Athens to experience 50°C during the summer/ Greek Ministry of Climate Change

[mesogeiakos]

In fact we just had the data from HMNS for Attica for the 16th.

As expected,since little by little the Meltemi winds are dying the traditional powers are starting their usual behavior.

Nea Filadelfeia after almost 10 days dominates again and look at the extremely low minimum for Attica's standards!As always N.Filadelfeia shows this typical Andalusia like climate...Thank God they reopen the site with a new station in the Alsos of Nea Filadelfeia

 

[mesogeiakos]

Sao dados puntuais, a persistencia do calor em esses paises nao se pode comparar com o sur da peninsula iberica. Somente o sur de Rusia (area do mar Caspio) pode ter alguma afinidade con o sur da iberica. Aparte algums dados sao dubidosos, como os 47ºC de Amendola ou mesmo os 48ºC de Elefsina e Tatoi, as duas estaçaos de atenas (esta ultima estaçao, Tatoi, tambem tem 48ºC, é una estaçao que nunca sube de. 40ºC)

Badajoz é muito mais quente que Bucarest.
Badajoz oficialmente tem 25,7ºC de media em julho:
http://www.aemet.es/es/elclima/datosclimatologicos/valoresclimatologicos?l=4452&k=ext

The only place the European record is dubious is in the imagination of some of our friends

here you go!


http://wmo.asu.edu/europe-highest-temperature

As for Tatoi never having registered 40C please spare me.I mean where do u get ur data?From Tutiempo? I am surprised that your buddy Amending goes along with this fictional fairytale of Tatoi never reaching 40C.Ok I get it that you two have an ''issue'' with Athens but dont ridicule your self mate.I am hearing you without commenting repeating this fictional issue again and again,like for what?6 months?a year?Come on get over it now.Athens still remains warmer to Seville on average during the summer and whether u make up fairy tales or not changes nothing

http://kairikaarxeio.blogspot.com/

Anyway for our rest serious friends needless to say that 48.0C is the official European record registered in Athens in two areas on the 10th of July 1977

 

[mesogeiakos]

As an example of what I was saying here is also today's forecast for Attica from HNMS,as you can see East Attica is again given a lower temp forecast due to the winds ,while the west is given higher values specially bsc of the Western winds in Elefsina area and the relative absence of Meltemi winds in Athens basin

 

[Amending]

The stuff of the winds impacting eastern part of Athens more than western parts is mentioned also by

Giannopoulou et. al. (2011). On the characteristics of the summer urban heat island in Athens,Greece", Sustainable Cities and Society, 1(1) 16, 28.

Just these Authors specify the impact of these winds on Athens temperatures in a slightly different ways than our friend Thermonisidakos. In fact they say that these winds sweep away and reduce the urban heat island in eastern parts of the greater Athens area. Then they add how western part is more industrialized and heated by thermal pollution.
So in short at the East there are more gardens, less dense urbanization, less industrial pollution and winds help in removing stagnant antropic heat. In western parts antropic heat is stronger and wind is weaker, so orography, and antropogenic heat and more scarce wind develop a magic mixture of UHI magnification.
The explanation of Psematakos is good. The only missing concept in his discourses is urban heat island. He always babbles about heat climatology but he omits the elements revealing its nature of urban climatology, which are urban heat island, industrial heat island, and thermal pollution. The detail of how UHI concept hasn't yet become a part of his conceptual toolbox after 15 years of investigation is very very interesting.

 

[Ferreiro]

The only place the European record is dubious is in the imagination of some of our friends

here you go!


http://wmo.asu.edu/europe-highest-temperature

As for Tatoi never having registered 40C please spare me.I mean where do u get ur data?From Tutiempo? I am surprised that your buddy Amending goes along with this fictional fairytale of Tatoi never reaching 40C.Ok I get it that you two have an ''issue'' with Athens but dont ridicule your self mate.I am hearing you without commenting repeating this fictional issue again and again,like for what?6 months?a year?Come on get over it now.Athens still remains warmer to Seville on average during the summer and whether u make up fairy tales or not changes nothing

http://kairikaarxeio.blogspot.com/

Anyway for our rest serious friends needless to say that 48.0C is the official European record registered in Athens in two areas on the 10th of July 1977

Estaçaos da rede secundaria de AEMET também mediram temperaturas superiores a 48ºC no 2003. O problema que AEMET somente da información climática das estaçaos da rede principal, que sao basicamente as capitais de provincia. Mas há muitas pequenos locais donde se medirom mais de 48ºC em 1978 e em 2003:

http://foro.meteored.com/meteorolog...+los+datos+en+la+primera+pagina-t50415.0.html

Inclusive o teu enlace da Universidade de Arizona também o reconhece no ultimo parágrafo:
Unconfirmed reports also indicate that a set of Spanish stations may have hit 48.0°C during the 2003 heat wave.

Os 48.5º foram medidos por uma estaçao oficial do goberno regional de Sicilia. As redes de meteorología regionais nao formam parte da WMO, mas isso nao impide que os 48.5ºC sejan oficiais e correctos.

Mais dubidosos sao os 48.0º de Tatoi (Atenas). A sua segunda temperatura mais elevada de sempre em Tatoi, acho se nao me lembro mal que é de somente ums 42ºC. Con isso ja digo todo. Temdo en conta esa escasa fiabilidade das temperaturas medidas em Atenas, tampouco confio nos 48.0ºC de Elefsina (Atenas).

 

[mesogeiakos]

I can also say in a forum that I can fly,now who believes me or not is another issue.Since obviously my flying abilities sometimes overtake Superman I tend to trust the official AEMET record for Spain.

 

[mesogeiakos]

The stuff of the winds impacting eastern part of Athens more than western parts is mentioned also by

Giannopoulou et. al. (2011). On the characteristics of the summer urban heat island in Athens,Greece", Sustainable Cities and Society, 1(1) 16, 28.

Just these Authors specify the impact of these winds on Athens temperatures in a slightly different ways than our friend Thermonisidakos. In fact they http://www.meteopt.com/forum/images/smilies/rain.gifsay that these winds sweep away and reduce the urban heat island in eastern parts of the greater Athens area. Then they add how western part is more industrialized and heated by thermal pollution.
So in short at the East there are more gardens, less dense urbanization, less industrial pollution and winds help in removing stagnant antropic heat. In western parts antropic heat is stronger and wind is weaker, so orography, and antropogenic heat and more scarce wind develop a magic mixture of UHI magnification.
The explanation of Psematakos is good. The only missing concept in his discourses is urban heat island. He always babbles about heat climatology but he omits the elements revealing its nature of urban climatology, which are urban heat island, industrial heat island, and thermal pollution. The detail of how UHI concept hasn't yet become a part of his conceptual toolbox after 15 years of investigation is very very interesting.

I understand that our friend Amending has a limited understanding of the Greek climate,Athens basin (what it actually is basically) ,the geography of Attica and apart from overgeneralizing a random quote from an article contributes nothing less than mambo jambo talk in order to bring up irrelevant issues to those discussed.

Now apart from the problems in Amending's cognitive skills to understand that I was reffering to the Mesogeia plain and not the Athens basin (hello Spata!) we see a constant tantrum filled with superficial knowledge of the area.Now I suggest to Amending,instead of playing hide and seek from his laptop trying to find a quote,a line or a comma to support his tantrums,to actually come and visit Athens

Now lets entertain our friend and ask him the quote word for word to see how different it is from what I actually said (provided the cognitive skills of our friend got what I was saying)

The main issue in Amending's narrative is an ongoing fixation with the warm climatology of the warmest area of Europe during the summer.His thesis always omit the climate change pattern seen in Greece and the dynamics of climate change as the main if not the only factor of Athens' constant heating the past decade,something which is thoroughly investigated by the Ministry of Climate Change in Greece (hello we do have a whole Ministry dedicated on this issue) and which suggests the main reasons for Athens reaching a potential 50C is the alarming news coming from the climate change of South Europe

It is obvious that our friend dreads the reality of constant warming in the whole of SE Med and it is very interesting the fact that he constantly omits to bring it up in his tantrum like Thesis.Point being that either way Athens and Attica has a unique dynamic in Europe during the summer which can not be easily surpassed by none in the continent


Btw currently N.Filadelfeia stands at 37C along with Kalamata from the HNMS stations.Will keep u update on the Athens heat!!

 

[Ferreiro]

Até o propio dr. Sarantopoulus, de nacionalidade grego, reconhece que um grupo de estaçaos espanholas chegaram (e superaram) a 48ºC.

As duas estaçaos gregas que chegaram exactamente a 48ºC foram Elefsina e Tatoi, esta última com uma segunda temperatura mais alta de sempre de somente 42ºC. Com isso quedam em dubida os dados gregos. Que ainda semdo certos tampouco son record de nada, ja que Catenanuova (Sicilia) tem 48.5ºC, bastante mais fiaveis que os 48ºC de Tatoi e Elefsina, e varias estaçaos espanholas da rede secundaria tambem por cima dos 48ºC.


http://wmo.asu.edu/europe-highest-temperature

 

[Dan]

O site referido ainda apresenta o valor de 57.8°C em El Azizia, Libya como válido apesar de actualmente esse registo estar completamente desacreditado. Só para se ter uma ideia, o recorde actual dessa localidade (El Azizia, Libya), registado em condições correctas, é apenas de 48ºC.

O mesmo acontece com o valor de 56.7°C em Furnace Creek Ranch, CA, USA, também registado em condições deficientes.

 

[Ferreiro]

O site referido ainda apresenta o valor de 57.8°C em El Azizia, Libya como válido apesar de actualmente esse registo estar completamente desacreditado. Só para se ter uma ideia, o recorde actual dessa localidade (El Azizia, Libya), registado em condições correctas, é apenas de 48ºC.

O mesmo acontece com o valor de 56.7°C em Furnace Creek Ranch, CA, USA, também registado em condições deficientes.

Correcto, esses registos sao reconhecidos pelo WMO, mas todo o mundo sabe que nao sao certos.

 

[mesogeiakos]

Dr Randy Chervenky is the head of the WMO research for the records and not a Greek scientist (I mean spare me now).In case you have a difficulty Ferreiro reading and comprehending the English language, the WMO has said officially that they will reconsider the world record but not the European which goes to Athens

 

[mesogeiakos]

As I have mentioned earlier I was expecting today at last the south suburbs of Athens to return to their normal temperatures and I was right.With the ease of the Meltemi winds Nea Filadelfeia rocked Attica with nearly 39C while the rest remaining much lower,even Elefsina due to absence of favourable conditions registered much lower.Sofades and Nea Filadelfeia had Greece's highest temperature for the 17th of July


Here are the data from HNMS

 

[Ferreiro]

Enquanto isso o grego tem que falar de uma previsao a 4 días para sonhar com os 40ºC em Grecia, ontem em Espanha, uma vez mais, em que pese a o verao fresco que temos até agora em gran parte da península ibérica, de novo mais de 40ºC.

 

[J.S.]

Isto nao é possivel em nenhum outro lugar de Europa, nem de longe.
Cordoba aeroporto verao do 2003. 17 días seguidos por cima de 40ºC.

http://www.ogimet.com/cgi-bin/gsodres?ind=084100-99999&ord=DIR&ano=2003&mes=08&day=16&ndays=31

Well, if people just look precisely a year ago we can see that various studies have clearly identified a strong heat isle over Athens. These have been detailed studies, showing how the heat isle effect somtimes breaks up etc. I think you can see whn someone is fanatic as Mesogeiakos and seems to lend some personal status from it, it is understandable that he will refute these things also refutes other European hotspots in order to keep Athens where it needs to be for him: at the top for average temperature during the summer.

On the topic of the heat wave in 2003: note that the daytime maximum temperature in Amareleja was even higher than in Cordoba. They reached a staggering 43,4 C over that period (if I remember correctly). Only Cordoba and Amareleja got 17 consecutive days above 40,0 C.

Portuguese inland is on average not as warm as parts of the Guadalquivir region or Greece. The nighttime temperatures are way lower (probably because of very dry cicrumstances and may be some soil inlfuences ad well, I a m not sure).

I have looked at Moura station (Herdade dos Lamierões) and contacted the meteorologist of that station (Jorge Maia) and he confirms this is complying to all WMO norms, also when it comes to distances to obstacles. This station in summer (as far as I could check) has daytime maxima of 36-37 C in the last years and is somewhat warmer than Sevilla during the day and somewhat cooler the warmest stations in the Guadalquivir region I could find (Ecija and Montoro). But we are talking about 0,5 C or so.

I have the data somewhere, but I am not getting in this debate again.

From all I know, the warmest region during daytime are parts of he Guadiana and Guadalquivir region. on average it is still the Guadalquivir and at night it is of course the eastern mediterranean seaside. That is how I see it. In total, the Guadalquivir region is the warmest part of the Europe in summer.

 

[J.S.]

Até o propio dr. Sarantopoulus, de nacionalidade grego, reconhece que um grupo de estaçaos espanholas chegaram (e superaram) a 48ºC.

As duas estaçaos gregas que chegaram exactamente a 48ºC foram Elefsina e Tatoi, esta última com uma segunda temperatura mais alta de sempre de somente 42ºC. Com isso quedam em dubida os dados gregos. Que ainda semdo certos tampouco son record de nada, ja que Catenanuova (Sicilia) tem 48.5ºC, bastante mais fiaveis que os 48ºC de Tatoi e Elefsina, e varias estaçaos espanholas da rede secundaria tambem por cima dos 48ºC.


http://wmo.asu.edu/europe-highest-temperature

The Italian value is not recognised by the Italian Metoffice. It still is 45,6 if I am correct iN Catania.

The wamrest official ever in Europe recognised is the one of Elefsina. I have strong doubts, looking at the site being possibly near a large tarmac aerobase not unlike Sevilla (one station in Sevilla is completely useless, but still used as oficial BTW. I have seen the pictures: it is absurd).
I have also looked at some agro stations surrounding Sevilla and especially at night these show strong, strong diversions from Seviall Aeropuerto. I remember last year somehting like 24 C on average at the Airport but all surrounding stations just outside the city near 21,5 C....On average over july.