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Tópico em 'Europa' iniciado por Mesogiakos 3 Dez 2012 às 10:29.
Was talking in terms of summer mean maxes.Half of South Greece (from Southern Attica to Crete) can beat Seville in annual means , a 19C mean annual is not a challenge for Greece.But in summer mean maxes the only area in Europe outside the IP to beat Seville until today is the Evrotas valley of Sparta and the Messara valley in South Crete.Potentially the Catania plains as well in Sicily.But I believe the strongest of all is Sparta.
As I said we do have good indications that Sparta is actually warmer in summer mean maxes compared to urban Seville.I ll give it 1-2 more years to see the behavior of both urban fan aspirated stations I am monitoring in urban Seville and I ll feel more confident,but for the time being and to my knowledge Sparta is the first and only station outside IP to ever beat Seville in summer mean maxes (meaning the entire JJA summer) even only for a few years data
Also an interesting find for Sparta vs Seville .The entire summer mean maximum (JJA) for Sparta in 2012 was 37.0C exactly.Seville's highest was in 2009 with 36.1C.In fact the highest ever for Cordoba was also recorded in 2012 with 37.06C.So Sparta and Cordoba are really close in the JJA mean max records!
Here is a mean maximum T breakdown for Sparta in summer 2012
Sparta is one tough bitch I tell ya lol
Yes, probably Cordoba and Sparta are close in summer mean maxes...
But we need data for more years.
Yes and all this due to the protection two of Greece's highest mountains give to Sparta from the moderating effects of the sea.
Sparta is at the very center of the Evrotas river valley between mountain Taygetus (2407m asl) in the south and mountain Parnonas (1935m asl) in the north.
Sparta is blocked from all directions (and I mean all directions,north,south,east,west) from various mountains from the mountain ranges of Taygetus and Parnonas.This coupled with the distance of 30klm from the sea in west (totally blocked from Taygetus) 50 klm from the east (totally blocked from Parnonas),40km from South and more than 100km from the north it provides some almost constant summer foehn winds,blocks the moderating effects of the sea and it is really south just at 37.04 degrees north.if only it was at lower altitudes (it is at 204m asl) I reckon it would have even wilder temps.
By all accounts I reckon this is the best u will find in Europe outside IP. Honestly it does not have any difficulty competing with the hottest areas of Guadalquivir and Andalusia.
Thanks for your explanation.
More data would be really welcome, though.
Obviously we need more data.But Sparta with only 4 years of data worth has managed not only to beat Seville but threaten even Cordoba in mean maxes.I am positive than now that we have Sparta station up and running we are gonna see Greece in a new light in terms of mean maxes.We have good indications that the Sparta valley will be relentless even against the Guadalquivir valley.
Over in the British forum I ve initiated a thread for the highest JJA mean maximums per country.Can you help me with Portugal? It's the only major southern european country missing.
Amareleja: 35,97ºC (2005)
Cheers thank you very much
And here is the updated table so far!If you have any info on other countries please do share!
Obviously that Amareleja is about IM stations. That board does include only a certain type of weather stations?
No for example Mengibar and Sparta are not AEMET or HNMS stations.I include all stations on the conditions a)they are a part of a national authority (not necessarily the meteorological authority per country) b) there is a verifiable link and info on the station and there is some consensus (among the natives of that specific country mostly) that the station is accurate and reliable c)if they are automatic stations on the condition they are fan aspirated ones.
So if you have something higher from Portugal shoot.Along with the link so I can verify the data
Ok, I´ll have a look on it and will try post it today.
Here is the last update.
Enjoy!!!Kudos to the guys over in the UK forum.Excellent job as always!
One interesting thing, it was done, while searching for the nearly impossible (from the main South European countries, Portugal is quite probably the less studied climatologically) I did managed to get some interesting data, though from Algarve (unfortunately the warmest areas in Algarve close to Monchique and others more inland, are still without data):
Min. Abs. -5.5ºC
Max. Abs. 44.4ºC
Castro Marim-Junqueira, 2006-2010:
Max. Abs: 43.5ºC
And this was only possible because of climate research for agriculture practices.
Unfortunately and as it is explained on this thread, none is located on areas with the biggest summer potential on the region, though the values are not bad. So until now, overrated Amareleja still stays there.
I did contacted the COTR group (http://www.cotr.pt/cotr_uk.asp), to get data from their stations (like Herdade dos Lameirões, Serpa, etc...), thought it are all located on plains, some could have get around the same as Amareleja or maybe a bit more (regarding summer values).
They say that information is private and only with money, people can get acess to it.
Well, I think that there are better ways to have this type of information.
I would like to know if that old Moura station, still gets temperature readings, the same for the one that´s close to Alcoutim and another one in Douro.
According to the IM estimations (which are calculated based on several aspects, such as temporary weather shelters that measure temperatures) the 3 months summer daily maximum average (1960-1990) was over 37ºc, in 2 regions (East Tagus and Douro Valley). In Douro (where it reached 37,5 in one location), more than one valley was calculated to surpass this value (37,0ºc).
In Guadiana it was about 35ºc, I think. For this case, I´m not sure how many places, according to this study got this value.
This is not 1 year record, is data for 30 years and the series is not particularly recent. This means that we would have to add something to these values, to have an idea how things work there nowadays.
The study was discussed before and I think that you maybe remember about it.
Now my opinion about this: I think that this study did opened the realistic hypothesis that the warmest areas (at least in continental Portugal) need to be in areas with low humidity on the air, very sheltered from winds, far from the sea influence (some places were over 200 kms from sea nearest point), in valleys or slopes (slopes get much higher minimum temps) located on a big continental mass (Iberia is big and low enough to generate its own heat even when the sea breeze hits the coast).
These areas aren´t studied, not even close to that.
But this study did located some the places that should be studied.
So, still a long way to go, to understand something about this humble country climatology.
Thanks for your patience and let´s hope to find something more.